[00:00:00] Speaker A: Hi, and welcome to The Social PR Secrets Podcast. We are on season three and I have my friend Joe Fear here as the guest. And hey, Joe, how are you?
[00:00:09] Speaker B: Hey, Lisa, thanks for having me on.
[00:00:11] Speaker A: Been a podcast, it has been a while and I thought it would be very appropriate because you're in the middle of doing a series outside of your podcast, talking about pod casting for profit. I've taken a little bit of a break on podcasting and now I'm back and I just thought it would be cool to talk about. We have so many overlaps, it seems like, in our business lives since we met four years ago. So I thought it'd be cool to talk about behind the scenes, both of our podcasts and how podcasting and PR really intersect.
[00:00:45] Speaker B: I love it.
[00:00:46] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:00:46] Speaker B: Everything is podcasting in my mind. I feel like everything passes through a podcast, and it's the case for both of us. It's how we met via a podcast at Mastermind that we held and yeah, no, let's talk about it, I guess. Lead me.
[00:01:01] Speaker A: Yeah. So Joe, you are the host of Hustle and Flow Chart. And when we met, you had a co host, Matt, and that I think I listened to your podcast for a couple years and then you were doing a Mastermind in Orlando, right where I lived. And we ended up meeting in person right before the Pandemic and very instrumental in taking podcasting to the next level for me and including it in my arsenal for not only my own podcast, but introducing podcasting to my PR world, whether it's guesting or hosting. So I'm just going to turn it over to you. Tell us a little bit about Hustle and Flowchart. For those that haven't heard, it's, one of my favorite podcasts and a little bit about what's happened since the Pandemic when we met to today, because now you're on your own and I'm going to turn it over to you.
[00:01:50] Speaker B: Cool, thank you.
[00:01:51] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:01:51] Speaker B: And podcasting entered my life, what, ten years ago, ten or twelve years ago, something like that. And I did not stay up. Like, there was definitely a gap in time before Hustle and Flowchart started. So Hustle and Flowchart is seven years old now, which is wild. And yeah, it's changed so many times over the years. We probably changed the direction. Obviously had a co host, like you said, Matt Wolf, he's gone off and now is doing future tools. And you can always shout out my brother from another mother, so check out futuretools IO. Like, great resource for AI tools and all that. But I ended up taking over the podcast after we split things in business and throughout the years, ever since I began, and him and I kind of began a lot in the same time. It was always content marketing and I always love chatting with people, meeting new people. I've always found myself to be like the connector type, just naturally. And I don't know, I connect the dots and then I kind of see the big picture, connect the dots. And I like to co create with others. And podcasting just naturally fit, especially a show where I can bring a guest on or guest on someone else's podcast and create something cool. Like you get to know someone, someone who's interesting.
For a while I wanted to connect with some bigger names and it's like, okay, well, how far can I reach? What kind of celebrities and people can I bring on? And then it was almost like a bunch of experiments as layered it with different ways to monetize and grow a fan base and audience. So throughout these, I guess what, the seven years of this show, it's been like one big experiment I'd feel like, and connected.
My network has grown tremendously via podcasting and getting this whole referral system going. Affiliate marketing has always been a big way to monetize throughout the years. Sponsorships, my own courses and training, consulting, it's developing now more into Masterminds and other bigger partnerships with equity in talks with companies, startup companies, softwares that integrate. So it's like podcasting has always been the core and it's kind of been this like flywheel thing over the years that picks up and the key to it is systems workflows and all that stuff, which that's pretty much what I've been preaching now these days.
[00:04:12] Speaker A: Yeah, I think also a key component that you have lived by besides the fact that you're a connector, which is always helpful. And podcasting is the ultimate form of networking, which I think a lot of people don't realize. And networking is so important when it comes to public relations and marketing and branding and being personable. But I think that you've really leaned in, you and Matt, and now you continue to lean into technology and using technology to your advantage. And that's something that has made podcasting more accessible than five years ago, is that it used to be like, oh, you need to have certain level of technology and equipment which is still important. I'm not downplaying that. But now with technology, not just with podcasting, but with marketing, we've seen so many leaps and bounds of innovation that have helped us continue to get better and make the process easier. So speaking of technology, I just want to kind of dive into also the last year and a half, how we both kind of took this detour into web three in crypto and then came back to kind of like where I think our passion and purpose really is.
Tell us I can talk a little bit about that. I mean, I took my detour into female disruptors and the femme coin and crypto and I'm still very passionate about web three. But when I went down that path that I decided, okay, I'm coming back to my roots where I am right now talking to you and coming back to social PR secrets and continuing the line of innovation. But tell us a little bit about what you learned in that detour over the past year.
[00:05:52] Speaker B: And a yeah, great set up there because it's been a journey the last year and a half, two or so prior to that, the Hustle and Flowchart podcast. I guess I didn't put enough foundation or tell what that show is, but Hustle and Flowchart, it's all mine now. And yeah, that's the co host. It's always been in the entrepreneurial marketing space. That was kind of like the ethos of it all and it changed variety, type of topics and guests. But really that's like the core thing. It's made for entrepreneurs. Small business about two years ago, that's the thing. You get shiny objects, or at least if you don't have enough bumpers or Guardrails and Focus, which at the time, I think we were kind of in between some projects. So we started hearing about Web Three, we started hearing about Metaverse and talked with you a lot, crypto.
[00:06:47] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:06:47] Speaker B: And we're like, wow, that's fascinating. What if we applied our marketing brains and all these interesting connections and what we built here with content over there where no one's doing marketing and basically create something brand new. And it's not always the best move for a business or especially one that's been going for a while. So we learned a lot. And I feel like we were quote, quote successful during this run about a year or so of really diving in. And honestly, what we did is we pivoted the podcast to Web Three specifically. Like gaming was even a part of it. And that came about because of some of the people that we were connected with. We ended up having Justin Khan on from Twitch.
He founded Fractal Now and his partner created Google Drive. I mean, like Google Fonts, like, smart, brilliant guys. And we're like, wow, we're reaching big. So we got some of the biggest names in Web Three. Animoca was our first client and they're a multibillion dollar company, like massive. So we're just like, holy moly, we're doing the right thing, we're reaching to the top. But then we realized, oh well, because of the economics, the crypto markets and all that, it killed us, it killed the industry. Money stopped flowing. We were on a good run to bring this whole content thing. We also were integrated, a lot of YouTube, and we're doing live streams, doing this whole broadcast thing. So throughout all that, the podcast was still there, but honestly, a lot of the people left, a lot of people were just not ready for the Web Three talk. And still to this day, obviously it's new, there's a lot of learning. I think a lot of people are getting burnt on the crypto markets as well. So it's like a sour taste in everyone's mouth a little bit. And it was the end of last year. So 2022 was when I decided it was in October. I decided I couldn't do it anymore. I felt too disconnected from the core group of people, including yourself, that in this whole network I built for the last ten plus years. I mean, I've been doing it about 15 years now in the marketing space and building this network here in San Diego. There's so many great marketers and entrepreneurs, and I'm in a couple of masterminds high level ones, kind of like you are with Baby Bathwater. I'm in one called Speakeasy, and it's like some of the greatest minds in the personal development space, experts, authors are there, and they're my buddies. They were clients. And I basically just, no, I'm going to forget about this whole space that basically built up the podcast and my connections and then go into the crypto space. Yeah, interesting disconnect.
[00:09:35] Speaker A: I remember reading your post, I think it was on Facebook when you decided to kind of come back to your roots. And I remember that whenever that was, it was right around the time where I was kind of like in this spinning moment with Female Disruptors and Web Three, and going to all these Web Three conferences and Web Three. What I realized in about November, December, and I talked to a lot of other people in Web Three that went to these same conferences was taking a toll on mental health for so many people. It was so stressful. I mean, we thought Web Two was stressful. Web Three is ten times more stressful because nobody was sleeping. Everybody was just trying to keep this crazy momentum going. Or like you said, chase the shiny object. And I think that Web Three is we're in the process of web three evolving. We just don't know where it's right now. Artificial intelligence is kind of taken over as the buzword is what's going to push technology from a marketing and just everything standpoint. But similar, I was in a similar space, and once I had already committed to the Female Disruptors event and we had a Web Three track, that was in January of this year, and the minute that that event ended, I was like, that's the end of one chapter. I don't know what the next chapter is, but this can't go on the way it wasn't sustainable. It wasn't bringing me the passion I thought it was female Disruptors was, but I just missed the social PR secret side of doing my weekly podcast and connecting and networking.
We've kind of both come back to now. Just here I am with season three, just launching the first episode the other day. But yeah, really my passion is helping businesses and training them and coaching and mentoring and advising and helping them to embrace technology and move forward with emerging technology that's going to help them get better results and make their life more efficient and happy at the same time.
Let's talk about mental health at the same time, keep your wellness in check, because if that's not in check, everything falls apart. So I know that that's something you're passionate about, too.
[00:11:48] Speaker B: It totally is. And that's how I repackaged the show Hustle and Flow chart at the beginning of 2023.
It's so funny because you and I live these kind of parallel lives, in business at least. But on the mental, it's definitely the way that we look at things, how we're built, I guess, as entrepreneurs, as people, because we've always connected on the way that we look at business, marketing, PR, earned media, like a lot of what you've taught over the years. And you're so invested in the PR community and even being a professor for a while and doing this.
I've learned so much from you, and you've helped me refine a lot of the thoughts and the ways that I approach content and basically presenting myself as a brand and really thinking through all these elements. And by far, I'm not perfect at all. But the beginning of this year, I was thinking about you because it was like, on the mental health side as well. There were definitely challenges of the last three years that I went through, last four years almost now. And so it was a toll, mentally, physically, business wise, seeing money dry up in a market that we basically pivoted everything to. We're like oh, crap. Okay. So it's like, I felt like I had a sumo wrestler sitting on my chest for most of last year 2022. And it really wasn't until the beginning of this year, 2023, when I decided and I got to give credit to James Shramco for telling me, hey, go do the podcast thing. Like, pick that back up. That's basically the castle that you left with all the gold bars in it, and you and Matt decided to go to the woods and play with something new and figure something out. But it's like the castle's still there waiting for you. And he was like, Go back there because people are still going to be there. And sure enough, they were. And it's been this whole repackaging of what does Hustle and Flowchart mean for me? What does podcasting mean? What does this whole business thing mean? And it's a lot more purpose driven now. Like to your point, with mental health wrapped up with entrepreneurship and marketing.
My bigger passion now is to not only help others express themselves through my podcast or through the trainings I give them, because I know we all have some kind of message that we have in us, and for whatever reason, we're probably being like, there's friction points on expressing that. And I felt like the podcast, for me, I needed some expression at the beginning of this year to talk about what the hell I've gone through. And a lot of other entrepreneurs are feeling burnout for a lot of the same reasons maybe they didn't all take the Web three route and all that, but a lot of them did. A lot of them got burnt hard. So that's all, like, the ethos of the show now. Hustle and flowchart is like, don't burn out while you're basically business should be the fuel for your life. It shouldn't be taking life away from you. It's like, we invest so much time and energy here. Let's make it right for us and then also for the greater community, people we're serving.
[00:14:53] Speaker A: Yeah. And I'm on the same page. And I remember, actually, Nava is who I interviewed for the episode right before this. And we've worked together for, like, 15 years, and we talked about just how because we were on the front lines of digital so early, from a marketing standpoint, it took a toll on us earlier than the masses. And I wrote digital detox secrets. And that's part of why I came to your mastermind, because I wrote digital Detox Secrets because it was my interpretation of how the digital world, you need to balance it in your personal and professional life. And here's how I did it, and here's how you can do it as an entrepreneur. But I was like, how do I fit that into social PR, my public relations agency, and I wrote this book on digital detox, how do the two connect? And it was hard to figure out because it wasn't as much of a thing as it is now. The masses understand that digital can. There's so many statistics on how digital can take us down from a mental and physical standpoint. But now it makes sense that I'm positioning myself as yes, I'm a public relations expert here to help and train and mentor. But I want you to keep your digital wellness in check. And here are some tips on how you can get the most out of what I'm training or mentoring. But you can't do it without these things like breath and meditation and taking breaks and things like that. And what are some of your tips that you can share that you do on a daily or weekly basis that other people can learn from?
[00:16:27] Speaker B: I love it.
[00:16:28] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:16:28] Speaker B: So this is what was the big reset for me this year. So is committing to a list of things that I'm committing to every single day. These little micro actions, these habits. And there's a group it's nice to have accountability. So there's a group of five guys that we check in with each other every single day. So morning and evening. And there's typically some kind of activation. So if it's breath work, like wim HOF breathing, I like to do like three rounds of that, 50 reps each round and then hold. And I can see how my lung capacity usually translates to how well I'm feeling for the day. And if I don't do that activation, something up top is just not as clear in my mind. So breath work is great. Push ups, like I always make sure I nail 100 in a day. I've noticed I've gotten a lot stronger just from simple little things like that. And this is all like a trackable spreadsheet. I actually tick boxes every single day. So I'm tracking data and seeing kind of these trends and drinking enough water sleep. There's journaling. There's a lot of self work, and that's helped me figure out what is it that I want, what are these things? Like, my superpowers, what are they? How do I lean into those things a lot more and then figure out how to delegate or maybe eliminate the rest and be very intentional? Like, I've started to really track my day closely in like 15 minutes, increments. I'm always trying these new things. I mean, this is just a short term thing to kind of dial things in further, but I'm a big believer now of getting a lot of help. I have a few core members on my team that really do a lot of the stuff that I was just kind of doing in the beginning, and it was draining me out. It was like, okay, if I don't get help, like, ASAP, someone that can help with the podcast production, get me out of the admin parts of my business, like, I'm going to lose my mind. I used to have a business partner that helped with that, but now I'm like, I don't have that. Yeah, that's I think a big mental shift. For me, it was tough, but it's like for my mental health too.
Those are things I focus on.
[00:18:38] Speaker A: Yeah. And I'll just add to that one of the things you talked about was sleep. So that's been a big focus for me and my husband for a couple of years now, but really intensely over the past maybe three to six months.
One of the first things we say to each other in the morning is, what was your sleep score? What's your readiness score? Because we're just realizing how our quality of sleep impacts the outcome of our day, no matter what, and especially stress. And we go into these roller coasters of stress, whether it's business or personal, and you just can't handle stress unless you have enough sleep. I just never realized how critical it's not the hours you sleep, it's the quality of sleep and your routine before sleep that's going to impact your quality of sleep. So I've been really obsessed with sleep. And now I just this week learned or I just put this boundary up for myself, where after 06:00 at night, I'm not watching things that are upsetting, whether it's the news or crazy movies or crazy series that are even not even violence, but just that are just like, oh, my God, what's going to happen that you don't want to go to sleep? I wake up in the middle of the night thinking about whatever just happened before I went to sleep, whether it was watching the morning show or even.
[00:19:58] Speaker B: Like that's a good show. Yeah, it is a good show, but.
[00:20:01] Speaker A: It'S like, oh my God. Something you watch during the day, but that's something that I've really focused on and just detoxing things out of my life. Like just I'm doing a 30 day detox now with Dr. Savage who, you know, now and just getting out all of the stuff out of your gut or stuff that the environment might have unintentionally brought into your body that's bringing negative reactions physically.
[00:20:27] Speaker B: That's the thing. And yeah, I had a great discussion. He'll be on my podcast soon and thank you for the introduction. I was just chatting with him about him to the Lady Cut My Hair earlier this morning and talking about how it's like the three things that for longevity, sleep is a big one. I think the first one he said was diet and then exercise or movement in your body and then sleep. And it's true.
[00:20:50] Speaker A: Also mentioned journaling. And I think that I never really started journaling until this year. I have a notebook. Like, this is what mine looks like right now.
[00:20:58] Speaker B: Yeah, I got a couple in front.
[00:21:00] Speaker A: Of me and I was like, oh, do I have my list for business and my journal? So I just started combining the journal with my business list and I'll do like totally, I'll do like a list. Okay, top five things or top things that I'm afraid of today, or top things that are making me happy today. And it makes a difference on what you shift. But I think talk therapy is very important. But the ultimate talk therapy is actually podcasting. I think podcasting is a form of journaling out loud and it's also a form of talk therapy because you're talking to people that typically you're not going to go on a podcast unless you're going to feel good from that podcast. You're making people, educating them or sharing your experience and hopefully you're not going to have anybody on your podcast that's going to make you feel bad. You're going to talk about things you love to talk about.
[00:21:51] Speaker B: Right? It's like, we're curating how we feel, everyone can do this. And this is why I love podcasting, because you don't have to have your own show. You can go to other shows and do this and show up with great energy with the plan of why you're doing this thing. Obviously there could be a very much of a business intention behind it and should be if you're a business person, if you're using this for visibility and referrals. But yeah, in terms of a therapeutic side of things, I love it. And connecting with people, this is one way. And to almost talk therapy this way, it's helped me throughout the years of my show. I feel like I've become a better communicator, thinker just person in general, but then even the solo episodes, those are freaking hard. Lisa, earlier this year, I was like, how do I do this? I don't even know how to structure my thoughts, where I have all these frameworks, but then we always get in our heads. It's like when you hit the record button, you're like and the more you do it, it's that expression that I know I needed, at least especially in the beginning of this year, I was like, I need to tell my story, or at least explain some of these. And a lot of them comes from journal entries. It's like, yeah, you have some AHA moment, a breakthrough. One of them recently, for me was like, hey, I'm naturally a very curious and creative person, and I can go deep in so many ways, all the way from music, art, working out, running crazy marathon, like, all sorts of stuff I'm like. But if I don't create the time and space for that, then I'm stifling me as a person. So why the hell wouldn't I go hire an EA or someone to manage all my inboxes, which drains my energy and takes a lot of time, helps me organize priorities, my calendar, some of these editing, it's like, these aren't things that are bringing me joy, necessarily.
How do I create more of life for me? And really, a lot of that comes from journal entries and then talking it out either through podcasts with you or solos, and then ultimately, hopefully, it becomes reality.
[00:23:58] Speaker A: Yeah, that's true. It's like in the yin and yang of digital. It's like, we can't live with it and we can't live without it. So we have to kind of separate out what is serving us in a digital way and what is not, and getting help or boundaries or outsourcing.
So, yeah, I think podcasting might be the most ultimate PR expression because of audio. It's personable you're, storytelling, you're in real time, you're in your voice, your tone. You're able to express yourself in a way that, yeah, you can turn your podcast, your audio, into, we're doing video right now, and maybe we'll share it. But I just think audio is just like it's the ultimate form of expression, and it's therapeutic and it's efficient and effective.
[00:24:48] Speaker B: Yeah. And there's a whole I think, Lisa, you and I should do a series, and definitely you'll be on my podcast.
[00:24:54] Speaker A: This might even be published or podcasting.
[00:24:58] Speaker B: I like it.
[00:24:58] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:24:59] Speaker B: So maybe this will be the kickoff. I'll do a little it's not simulcasting, I'm told, but yeah, maybe we'll go put this over there too. But I'm thinking out loud now.
[00:25:08] Speaker A: Well, yeah, I'm totally ready for that. I know that you have a cut off soon right now, but just drop a quick one liner about podcasting for profit and where we can go to sign up.
[00:25:19] Speaker B: Sweet. Yeah, right now. I mean, right now, get the checklist, because I have this 16 point checklist that basically walks you through my thought pattern, all the stuff that I've learned over the years and experimented, but not only myself, but with clients and partners. You included, Lisa, and in this checklist. So if you go to Prsecrets, that will take you there totally free. So hustleandflowchart.com Prsecrets, and then also just reach out to me. I'll just give you my email address,
[email protected]. Let me know what you're thinking. I'm always happy to hop on calls with people who are genuinely interested and happy to do a quick 15 minutes call or whatever with you that kind of walks through what you got going on. If you have podcasting, I'm happy to help. And anybody who's following Lisa, friend of Lisa, is definitely a friend of mine. I know it's a cliche thing to say, but it's true.
You you bring good people around here. So thank you very much.
[00:26:18] Speaker A: Well, thank you so much for being part of season three of Social PR Secrets, and I know you have to get on your next call, so thank you so much, joe and namaste, everybody.
